hit counter
Christ On Campus

Christian Keesee | Toon Manager
Published 12-9-05




tagline

Post a New Comment
Name: Email:
Subject of your post:
Your Comment:
No Subject
Posted by Shaun

Best one yet.
Wow
Posted by David

This is pretty much the best comic ever. Hahaha I loved it man.
Great idea
Posted by David

Great "K"ristian Let's show some damn towel head with a knife in their body as a cartoon or maybe depict a black person being lynched... See if people think that is funny. I know I don't.
No Subject
Posted by grace face

very creative...but you're still going straight to hell for that hahaha! oh yes i saw james today...and i confirmed that we are his favorites! haha go us!
No Subject
Posted by David (the cool one)

Posted by David

Great "K"ristian Let's show some damn towel head with a knife in their body as a cartoon or maybe depict a black person being lynched... See if people think that is funny. I know I don't.

God we have heard it before. Get over it, and stop posting under my name cause I kick ass and you don't.

Great
Posted by John

Why did you spell his name with a K? Is that how it is really spelled? I think this is funny as hell and had nothing to with "towel heads" or black people. Why would you even bring that up?
No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

Ok, let's not drag this cartoon's comment section down into a discussion about religion, hate speech, or some sort of relativism that doesn't even matter.

We know how everyone feels and I am so sick of beating the dead horse.

Wow
Posted by Jen

that's probably the coolest thing ever. never mind religion, it's a common issue that christmas has been taken over by commercial stuff. that's the message. commercialism killed christmas. leave it at that. but seriously i love it. the whimsical joy of christmas classics with attempted murder to boot. hilarious and very well made
No Subject
Posted by Halley!

THAT'S HILARIOUS!!!
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

This is disguesting. Maybe Blake was right. I didn't really have anything against the others but this one shows a religious figure attempting to kill another person and in the end he is killed. I think there might be some argument in what Blake and the others like Erskine, Seay, and Turpin said. This one really makes a religious figure look bad.
No Subject
Posted by Nicolae

Yea! Yea! Stupid Christians! Gosh what's the problem with these idiots!? I don't care if we #$^^# kill a "religious figure" here, this is so fuckin funny! Let's kill Mohammad next time, that would be so funny, HAHA!
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

OMG! I'm JEWISH, and find this to be just TERRIBLE!!! This is one of the most disgusting and repulsive things I have ever seen! Satire is one thing, but this is pure HATE and TRASH. It has no redeeming value.
No Subject
Posted by Greg

hey jesus isnt dead... hes alive at the end of it.. idiots... am i the only one who sees that? plus its like making fun of how santa side of christmas always beats the religious side... maybe its just me, but i think its pretty good.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Wow . . . people really have a stick up their asses.

I hope NONE of you watch South Park, Family Guy or the Daily Show.

No Subject
Posted by Missy

Will you marry me? <3 some fat kid. ps. Joe says you have to.
No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

Yeah, I definitely got the idea that this was depicting how Christmas has become more about presents and Santa and reindeer than Jesus. Comical, yet proves a point. I think it's great! Well done!
No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

I also noticed that Jesus seems to be defending himself in the first one and running in all the rest. I think Santa's trying to kill Jesus, not the other way around. Just a note.
Love it!!
Posted by Julie

Best one yet...and quite true. Great job.
Question...
Posted by Julie (again)

I have a question for the people who don't like the Christ on Campus cartoons in general: Why do you continuously look at these cartoons every week if you know they are going to anger you? Just curious.
No Subject
Posted by John

I think you guys look at em cause this guy is obviously really good! I think whether you are offended or not by these, they are really nice to look at.
Jesus people!!!!
Posted by Kim

Okay, I get that some of you are offended and whatever, but look at the awesome artwork and creativity. "Christ"ian (come on...ur using a freakin "K" instead..) has a great talent and continuously publishes great work. So cartoon Santa and cartoon Jesus got in a cartoon fight...look beneathe the surface of the Son of God, religious thing for a moment and see what he was really trying to say...and the fact that it was funny makes it all the more interesting, creative, and the best cartoon I think he's ever done. If you don't like it, don't read it, you're just setting yourself up to be offended. Who their right mind goes out of their way to get pissed off?
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Julie: I have a question for the people who don't like the Christ on Campus cartoons in general: Why do you continuously look at these cartoons every week if you know they are going to anger you? Just curious.

I check them because I guess I call myself a watchdog third party - if I see something I don't like I complain about it. This one I didn't like at all. The one last weekend was ok although I figured Christians would get upset because Jesus was smoking and also whoever follows the religion with that purple chick. I just thought this one was horrible.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

God do I love all those "arm-chair third-party watchdogs" that keep us poor Americans safe from things like "freedom of speech" and "freedom of expression."


No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Anonymous: I do know the difference between "freedom of speech" and the forms of speech that the government has allowed people to stop. Don't act like I'm an idiot. I have just as much a right to complain as you do to complain about my complaint.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

"I do know the difference between "freedom of speech" and the forms of speech that the government has allowed people to stop."

If you are implying that this is a form of speech that the government has allowed people to stop, then I will act like you are an idiot.

No Subject
Posted by Doug

The ironic thing is that half of these toons that you people get your panties wrapped up too tightly over actually support Christianity. However, it is quite clear that the intellectual capacity is lacking in many people. The ability to interpret and analyze the subject matter is simply beyond you.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Doug: "The ability to interpret and analyze the subject matter is simply beyond you."

Ok then, analyse it for me and the rest of us lacking the intellectual capacity of a kindergartner.
No Subject
Posted by kristen

i stand by the fact that this is the best cartoon ever! and the fact that it sends a very important message is even better...
No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

First of all, I have never seen Christian make fun of Christianity, only the hypocrisies within Christianity. In this case I, and most people that can see the meaning behind these cartoons, took this as people forgetting what Christianity says is the true meaning of Christmas. Santa "beats" Jesus every single year as far as importance. I don't think it's saying more than that at all. I don't see why everyone is so uptight about this kind of stuff. These are no more offensive than little bunny rabbits in a meadow. The difference is that it's a controversial topic and people just have a tendency to take everything as an attack.
No Subject
Posted by Doug

"that's probably the coolest thing ever. never mind religion, it's a common issue that christmas has been taken over by commercial stuff. that's the message. commercialism killed christmas."

Someone already did it.

Once again
Posted by David

I am totally serious, let's try this. I should draw a cartoon with a soldier stabbing some damn towel head and then have one of Bush drowning the black people in Katrina. Is that funny? Neither is this.
No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

Yet it seems that some people didn't get it the first time.
Ho Ho Ho
Posted by Kellee

Why aren't the people who post all the criticisms and who think your cartoons are blasphemy busy running the country? Wait...I think they already are. Get a grip, people. This is hysterical! Nice job, CK.
some more thought for idiots
Posted by KB

I taught Christian for all of his four years in high school. He was my newspaper cartoonist. He has an astonishingly fantastic personality, with the talent to boot. Lets give the guy some credit for putting himself out there so you can express your dumb-ass opinions. (of course I'm not speaking to those of you who love Christian's work) Enough said.
No Subject
Posted by Blake

Ok people I'll jump in here and ask far we can go before stuff becomes too extreme to publish.

What about David's example of Bush drowning black people or shooting Arabs in the head? Although I would never support such a comic, if I were to publish one mocking the Jews in the Holocaust...from what I gather from you people you would find some idiotic way to defend it.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Posted by David

"I am totally serious, let's try this. I should draw a cartoon with a soldier stabbing some damn towel head and then have one of Bush drowning the black people in Katrina. Is that funny? Neither is this."

Actually that does seem kinda funny...he..he .. he

No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

They don't care Blake, they just want their cheap laughs.

New ideas for new comics:
-Killing Muslims (the joke is on the symbolic destruction of the extremist's view that America is warring against)
-Killing the Jews (they didn't really rebel as much as they could have in WWII and the joke will be on that)
-Raping children (haha, they're too young to defend themselves)

Anyone want to take up these ideas? Someone's bound to defend the most foul of concepts so I tried to come up with some ideas for you guys. Publish these now.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

"Actually that does seem kinda funny...he..he .. he"
Wow, that's sick isn't it.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Oh thanks for the HTML help Blake.

I was just wondering if Christian would consider going away from these "symbolism" comics and back to the funny ones like the thumb-slide joke. That one was good but this one isn't.
No Subject
Posted by Dave

"from what I gather from you people you would find some idiotic way to defend it."

Blake honestly man, you always find a way to get under my skin and piss me off. The way I figure it you can write and say anything you want. It might be "idiotic" to some, but its your fucking freedom. Why attack your one true freedom? If your so Christian and Patriotic then WHY do you judge this so much? Your a fat kid with the power to write i'll give you that. Your a better writer than most of us here, yet you cant even see that we are defending your reason to blast your "idiotic" views.

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

New ideas for new comics: "-Killing Muslims (the joke is on the symbolic destruction of the extremist's view that America is warring against) -Killing the Jews (they didn't really rebel as much as they could have in WWII and the joke will be on that) -Raping children (haha, they're too young to defend themselves)"

Like I said before all funny funny funny!!!

the Child Raping one is my favorite! (why do you people take things too seriously?)

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

"What about David's example of Bush drowning black people or shooting Arabs in the head?"

Bush drowning black people in katrina would have actually made an interesting political piece (though it is now way too late for it).

The shooting Arabs in the head is just a reach. Just like the "ha ha let's make fun of Jews in the Holocaust."

It is no surprise to me that people who are too superficial to understand anything are trying their hardest to grasp for straws in the midst of a severe cause of attempted relativism.

No Subject
Posted by Blake

"Why attack your one true freedom? If your so Christian and Patriotic then WHY do you judge this so much?"
Even as a writer, I have restrictions. The freedom of the press and speech have restrictions as the Supreme Court has defined. I'm not going to post anymore than this but I think this would fall under one of those restrictions but that's my opinion. I'm not going to try to take yours away - I'm just going to say I think it's totally wrong. That's free speech if I recall.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

The shooting Arabs in the head is just a reach. Just like the "ha ha let's make fun of Jews in the Holocaust." It is no surprise to me that people who are too superficial to understand anything are trying their hardest to grasp for straws in the midst of a severe cause of attempted relativism.


Tell me how it's a reach. Tell me where the line is here. What is the difference between this and my proposed idea?
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

What's the point in it?

It is quite obvious, Ken, that you missed the point of the entire cartoon, that you continually miss the point. I know we have to hold your hand and explain everything to you. Your making fun of the Holocaust and shooting Arabs in the head are just shock value.

No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

There's a huge difference. Can you actually not see the difference between making fun of people for the sake of making fun of people and making a political statement?
No Subject
Posted by Jesus

Lighten up!
No Subject
Posted by April

i dont really find this offensive myself, not being religious. unfortunately, if i were, i would. plus its unneccessarily violent. and even if it werent, i thought it was THE STUPIDEST comic ever. what the heck happened to your sense of humor, REALLY. do you have a life???? well get one. obviously you dont like christmas and thats fine, but geez, posting something on the web like that only makes you out to look like an idiot. why dont you get alife and enjoy it. this is really the stupidest thing ive ever seen. like its not even funny bc of the stupidity its just blatantly dim-witted and youre seeking attention. by the way, did you get permission to use those clips from the movies?? because i highly doubt you did. thats illegal, dumbass. find a better hobby next time. <33
GRRR!
Posted by Heather

as a person with a strong faith in God, i happen to find this cartoon to be very wrong! i dont stick your "Gods" with a knife! so i would please ask that you would not do it to mine. any who find this funny in any way...i'll pray for you tonight. and i would hope that others would feel the same way i do.
No Subject
Posted by Sarah

Jesus is alive! He loves you even though you put him down.
No Subject
Posted by John

Actually this is not putting your God down. As everyone else has said it proves a point. Clearly this guy does have a life since he seems to put a lot of time and effort into his comics and section. As for the movie clips, they probably were used without permission. If it weren't involving religion, chances are you woudn't even give a shit. Keep up the good work Christian.
To the Idiots
Posted by Ray

Ok, let's not drag this cartoon's comment section down into a discussion about religion, hate speech, or some sort of relativism that doesn't even matter.
But this is about religion and very distasteful abuse of freedom of speech. I liked the other ones for the most part. The one where He was carrying a cross was a little close, but this one is over the edge. You have to realize people die everyday for their beliefs in religion and you are making fun of the most sacred of their symbols.

I hope NONE of you watch South Park, Family Guy or the Daily Show


You mean the episode of South Park where Jesus goes to save from the towelheads? Maybe you meant the Chrismas episode of Family Guy when Lois realizes Chrismas isnt about the material aspects and is about togetherness, a direct contradiction to this cartoon, and anyone with half a brain stopped watching the Daily Show after it become blatently liberal. But the Daily Show is a whole other argument.

The ironic thing is that half of these toons that you people get your panties wrapped up too tightly over actually support Christianity.


I think this needs to be taken cartoon by cartoon because as I and others have said, some of them are kinda funny and we dont have a problem with em. When you have Santa chasin Jesus and stabbing him in the back and leaving him for dead, then yea, some people are going to get "their panties in a bunch."

I am totally serious, let's try this. I should draw a cartoon with a soldier stabbing some damn towel head and then have one of Bush drowning the black people in Katrina. Is that funny?


Yea, I would

He has an astonishingly fantastic personality, with the talent to boot.


Yes, he does have wonderful talent. All of his drawings are great. However, that does not mean that he is except from morals. I'm sure a few Naziis were better artist than he was

You guys bottom line is everyone is talking about how a cartoon raping children and shooting Muslims would be such a stretch, but it really isnt. Just because you have the freedom to create this type of work doesnt mean you should. I have the freedom to call all black people niggers and all arabs dune-coons, etc., but that doesnt mean that I have to, nor should I want to. I really had no problem with a lot fo the comics. The fags made me laugh like you couldnt imagine. The one where they were playing cards made fun of all religions. This one has a good message, but the way it came about is just wrong. There are other ways it could have been done. So everyone getting pissed off, good, you should. It is your duty. Part of checks and balances. If everyone was as "openminded" as you people defending this cartoon, there would be no restraint in society. So I am personally glad to be one of the arm-chair third-party watchdogs because we keep this country from going down the shitter. And you know what? What the hell do all you socialist on the left think you are doing everytime you gripe about the war? Maybe you are so openminded your brains have fallen out and you dont realize the hypocrasy of that statement.

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

What's wrong Ray...you got a little sand in your vagina? Does it itch?
Santa & Christmas
Posted by Christi

Okay children, this is a comic. It is a crude ignorant comic, but a joke none the less. I hate to tell you all this but... Santa isn't around anymore. He is a symbol of a man that once was, who put candy in the shoes left out of night. He was a good man, who showed God's love by giving to those less fortunate. Jesus Christ our Lord and Savior is very real indeed. By creating comic strips that mock Him, and Christianity you aren't going to go anywhere in life. Mr. Keesee, are you a Christian? Who gave you the authority to mock the person who gave you the life that you so live? Jesus Christ died for your sins, if you are trying to represent how society killed Christ the first time around with the crucifixion, then I don't think you communicated it very well. Why don't you try again. Mr. Heesee, Jesus did die about two thousand years ago due to those wanted worldly influences. But you see, three days later HE ROSE AGAIN. You're missing that part. If you want more information try www.answersingenesis.org & www.biblegateway.com. Look up the first Chapter of Luke. It's wonderful. Merry CHRISTmas.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Wow, there's a handful more of people here not liking this comic than the editions before.
Um
Posted by Ken Ritz

Here a thought: did Christian get permission from the various producers of those movies before using their images in his cartoon? If not that could be really bad if they looked at this page.
But but but ...
Posted by Rick Snee

He's saying Christ can't be killed, even by Santa and commercialism. He's still alive, although hurt at the end. If you can interpret the Bible, how can you not get this?

Great comic as usual, Christian.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Is that a threat, Ken?
No Subject
Posted by Zoe

Christian, I love all of the Christmas movies as backgrounds! This is definately your most creative one yet. I'm not sure if I really like the ending...but I do like how Jesus is merely hurt, not dead...you'd think people would take some comfort in THAT and not get so offended...oh well.
No Subject
Posted by Janus Coin

Heather, I don't recall Christian mentioning God in this comic. It's JESUS! I'm not even a Christian and I can tell the difference...
S.O.S.D.D.
Posted by Jeff

"Here a thought: did Christian get permission from the various producers of those movies before using their images in his cartoon? If not that could be really bad if they looked at this page."

No, as a matter of fact he probably didn't get permission. What kills me is that this Ken guy keeps returning to the comic to post comments. I think that if this comic wasn't offensive and pertaining to Jesus and religion, you guys wouldn't be bitching about whether he had permission to use it. I'm not up to date on copyright stuff so I'm not sure, but isn't using something for educational purposes ok? This is a University ran publication? Like I said I could be wrong there.

What everyone is missing is that this looks great! He took the time to make it look kind of like they were cartoons in each of the well known Christmas movies. Yes, it is crude I suppose but I see the point he is trying to make. It has nothing to do with being anti-religion. The way I see it, if that Erskine guy or the Blake kid can tell people not to bash their government or can preach about the bible then Christian can draw whatever he damn well pleases. Yes, there are more negative comments here but I'll bet there are more people than the ones who comment that would back him up.

Ray ...
Posted by Rick Snee

I have the freedom to call all black people niggers and all arabs dune-coons, etc., but that doesnt mean that I have to, nor should I want to.

No, you call Arabs "towelheads," if I recall correctly. Otherwise, your only other adjective seems to be "fags." Considering how much you post on here, you must have plenty of friends thanks to your winning personality.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

Two parts. First, I call the terrorist and people who hate America towel-heads. BTW, you totally missed the point. I was using that to exemplify that we all have the constitutional right to say things like that, but it doesnt mean we should. When I use it as a derogatory term, I use it to express my displeasure with their views. When Christian used his freedom of speech, he used it to make fun of my religion.

Second, everyone is saying its how you interperit the cartoon, so here is how I see it. Because of the movie backgrounds, it is like that this cartoon is supposed to mirror a movie. It is not that Jesus is still alive because Santa can't defeat him, it is the classic "let's have the bad guy not die in the end so we can set up a sequel." Christian didnt portrayed Jesus as being undefeated by Santa because He is stronger, rather Christian portrayed Jesus as surviving so he could have the classic cliff hanger ending where Jesus could come back for a round two. No deeper meaning, no trying to be political, just a straight up classic/cliche movie ending.

So ...
Posted by Rick Snee

No, I got your point. You say that it's okay to use hate speech and derogatory terms if you disagree with someone (although you also say that we "shouldn't want to").

That makes so much sense. I'm glad we have you around to set standards, Ray.

This post was typed without any derogatory terms dispite disagreement. Somehow, I managed.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

How people don't see that Jesus isn't the bad guy is beyond me.

SANTA is stealing Christmas (I thought Christian dumbed that down so everyone would get it). Stealing Christmas makes him the bad guy, like the grinch. Santa is a representation of all things commercial with Christmas. How even before Thanksgiving comes around, stores put on Christmas music, they have Christmas decorations, they plot to create the best sales. None of this has to do with YOUR GOD and the meaning of Christmas. It all has to do with materialism and the things that Jesus would be against.

So you pit the real meaning of Christmas (represented by Jesus) against the commercial aspescts of Christmas and they battle.

What happens? We think commercialism wins, but wait, no . . . Jesus isn't dead . . . which means that there is some hope for the real meaning of Christmas to prevail.

No Subject
Posted by David

It does not matter how deep your hidden messages are, using such a depiction yo convey them is what you did wrong.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

How deep the HIDDEN MESSAGES are? Jesus, I thought it was pretty damn obvious.

And speaking of South Park episodes, I do remember the one where Jesus went into Iraq with automatic weapons blazing before he was finally taken down.

No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

I don't think the way he conveyed it was wrong. The way he conveyed it is what made it so powerful. The message wouldn't hit most people as hard without this type of drawing. Again, I think it's wonderful.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

I understand what yall are saying, I just think it is a little graphic and disrespectful. If you wanted to portray commercialism taking over Christmas then I am fine with that because its true. However, given the nature of the previous cartoons it is hard to see it this way. Christ carrying his cross up Muse--how can that be interpreted any other way than sacriligious? You can't have a cartoon like that and then have one that is supposed to be intrepreted and have a deeper meaning. Where is Christian on all of this? I understand how yall interperate it, but what is his opinion on all of this?
Jesus.
Posted by Rick Snee

The point of that one was that nobody was helping Jesus and treating it like His dying for our sins wasn't a big deal.

I reiterate: how the heck can you interpret the Bible and not be able to get these?
No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

I don't know what you're talking about the one where Jesus was carrying the cross not being a symbol. I took it as people not realizing the burden/weight/sacrifice Jesus took on to save people. I dont' understand these being anything less than symbolism.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Anonymous: "Is that a threat, Ken?"

No I have no intention to get this taken down or to call up whoever made the movies. It was merely a thought that popped into my head that I thought might concern the bros at WHIM. I wasn't meaning it like "I'm going to go be a taddle-tell".
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

It's just if Christian really wanted to portray the apparent victory of commercialism over Christianity he could have had Santa have Jesus in his bag saying something like "It's MY holiday now!" - that would be clean symbolism. No Christian murdered Jesus in this one and had him tell a person to "go to Hell" - a thing any Christian would know is something Jesus would never say.
Seriously Get Over It People
Posted by Forget about it

I just don't understand how someone like Brian Erskine can write articles about how non-christians are going to be condemned to hell and whatnot and why people get angry, no one says, this article needs to be taken out. It was completely biased and all opinion and yet it wasn't removed.

Christian draws a cartoon. Key word being toon. He makes it about Christ, with each thing being a huge symbolic message about Christianity as a whole. He may make fun but he never outright makes a comment that is directed at harming anyone. Everyone wants it taken down. Is it so bad? Comparatively, we take a look at one's toon and because it isn't our opinion we want it removed, however if someone were to do a toon about Muhammad or the holocaust, these same people would have no offense to it what so ever. Stop being hypocrites.

Just because you don't like what is said, doesn't necessarily make it hate speech or whatever. People will always disagree. This is America and it is our right to complain. You all prove that every week. But there is no reason to read this if it bugs you. Don't give me the watchdog crap or the people for a better America. Make America better by your actions, not your complaints, your whining and your unhappiness.

This toon is going to be up until January 20th. That means for about a month, you're going to have to see it every time you click to read the comments because obviously Ken Ritz, Blake Fought and others are going to want it taken down.

Go read the completely conservative articles and tell me there is nothing wrong with saying that no one is tortured and then that they are being "justifiably" tortured. It is complete crap but because you agree with it, it makes sense.

Stop crapping all over Christian's toon. He worked hard on it. It is well-done, creative and obviously is good enough to get you people here to complain about it or else you wouldn't be waisting your time.

Lastly for all of you intolerant people who hate this cartoon, you need to stop being so tolerant of other types of hate going around. You have a guy on here calling arab people towelheads, someone else condemning non-christians to hell, another wanting to burn every non-christian book. Take a look in the mirror guys. You all are out of line and inappropriate.

Hey, Ken ...
Posted by Rick Snee

he could have had Santa have Jesus in his bag saying something like "It's MY holiday now!" - that would be clean symbolism.

I'm guessing you meant this to be a seperate sentence, but just forgot to punctuate. It happens, but I'm giving you the benefit of a doubt here.

The reason why you're not a cartoonist is obvious: if the strip ended with Jesus in Santa's sack, how would He triumph over commercialism? You'd rather have Christ asphixiating on Power Rangers in a bag rather than rising after being stabbed in the back? You're saying there's no phrase in the English language that makes stabbing someone in the back symbolic?

I'll help you out here: he's saying Jesus was stabbed in the back, or betrayed, by the commercial Christmas icon, Santa. And you're mad at the way he portrayed it after you've conceded your original interpretation was wrong?

Do you get mad when you see depictions of Christ on the crucifix? That's more brutal. Or is it okay because there's a message behind what happened to Him? Catch my drift, or do I need to spell this one out for you, too?
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Forget About it said: "You have a guy on here calling arab people towelheads, someone else condemning non-christians to hell, another wanting to burn every non-christian book."

And stabbing a religious figure to death isn't bad as well. I'm really starting to believe that Anti-Christian parade Blake described last week despite my initial belief that it was a joke.
What?
Posted by Rick Snee

Are you an idolator, Ken? Are you worshipping a drawing of Jesus? It's not real. It's a symbol. In His favor. If you're grieving and angry about Jesus "dying" in this cartoon, then you are worshipping a false idol. He doesn't even die--he's rising from the dead in the end.

I'm not anti-Christian--I'm a Roman Catholic--the oldest of Christian faiths still in practice.

I promise you no messiahs were harmed in the making of this comic stirp.
What's the difference?
Posted by Gregg

I'll tell you exactly what the difference is between Brian and this crap. Brian takes the time to study and pen analysis filled philosophical arguments. "K"ristian pretends to take some kind of high ground and try to use a disgusting vehicle to a-portray Jesus in a totally false light b-send a "good" message by defaming God on earth.

Other than that ... it still sucks.

No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

I'm not worshipping the cartoon. It's not a symbol, it's toilet paper. And don't attack me for alleged idol worship when you're laughing at the death of a religious figure. Now don't forget if next time an Arab is lynched - you laugh at that ok? Same goes for any living being as well, ok? This cartoon promotes violence.

And what's with the "K"ristian commments? I get they're an insult of some type but what it means I'm in the dark.
No Subject
Posted by THE TOILET PAPER KING

TOILET PAPER? THIS? YES YOU COULD USE THIS AS TOILET PAPER IF YOU SO WISHED! JUST REMEMBER TO USE BRAWNY OR QUILTED NORTHERN AS WELL WHILE YOU'RE AT IT!
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

You fundies are ridiculous.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Let me just get this straight
He's been compared to a nazi
been told he apparently has no life
his name is now spelled with a K because he's such a piece of shit he doesn't deserve to have a CH
Gregg is in love with Brian
You want to use his comic as toilet paper And Christian
Wow, these things are
I Wasn't finished
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

What I was saying was before i accidently click the post comment button is that these things are rediculous. The only ones who look like jackasses are the ones who are being a bunch of pricks about it.
God Lord n' Butter
Posted by Rick Snee

If a real Arab is lynched, yes, that is horrible. The real Jesus was not stabbed here. You're running out of arguements here, pal.

Honestly, you don't go to school here, do you? Did Blake send you here to make it look like another student hated the comic and wanted it banned? Because you're not on any of the rosters.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Laughed my ass off!!
Posted by Stephanie Taylor

How creative- i loved it, mixing the movie images and the cartoons-classic Good job Christian! Merry Christmas!!
No Subject
Posted by Ray

So because he doesnt go to school here he isnt allowed to be offended. And the idea that because this is a cartoon it doesnt make it offensive is a bunch of crap. I still want to know where Christian stands on this matter. Obviously he is aware of the outrage at this whole series, but why doesnt he just tell us how he meant it to be taken. Unless he is afraid because he really did want to portray Jesus dying at the hands of Santa and there really isnt any "deeper meaning" here. Maybe everyone here who is trying to justify it is reaching harder for a meaning than the ones who really see it as it is.
Okay, so maybe it's offensive ...
Posted by Rick Snee

Okay, so maybe it's offensive if you have no way of looking at art subjectively. Even a picture of an Arab being lynched can be used to antagonize audiences and show how horrible hate is. How an artist wants to get your attention is not your call, unless you're going to make your own art: maybe Christ Plays with Bunnies on His Sunday Off. Would that have any meaning? No, it would be fluff.

I don't have to "reach" for any of these meanings. You're just not reaching at all. You see the last panel of Christ being almost killed by Santa and decided that there is no message--Christian just wanted to kill Jesus for Christmas. If that's how you look at art, you might want to avoid majoring in English, Art, or Music. But I know you're smarter than that because you can appreciate punk music despite disagreeing with the lyrics, Ray.

As for Ken, you can't randomly find this comic online. Unless you know Christian's full name, you can't find it on google because of how many "Christ on Campus" organizations exist. If Ken doesn't go to school here, that means he was directed here and is acting the unwelcome "watchdog" of a school literary magazine. If he's that concerned, he can came to school here. That'd be like me having my dad try to censor articles here because I disagree with them.
Man, I'm dumb.
Posted by Rick Snee

Ken Ritz is the name of a character from one of Blake's favorite series of books. He even works back and forth mentioning Blake like they're best friends, yet never leaves an e-mail address.

My hypothesis: they're the same guy with the same righteous indignation.
Very Well
Posted by Christian

Though I don't feel as though I really need to explain myself, I'll do it anyways. I assumed the point of this comic was clear. Yes, I was trying to make a point. I am not trying to make a mockery of religion or the death of Jesus. Before I even drew this comic I knew I wanted to do one for Christmas that would depict the idea of the comercialized "santa claus" side of Christmas basically stabbing the religous "jesus" side of Christmas in the the back.

The movies are all holiday movies that more or less have nothing to do with religion. I thought it would make it visually interesting to see them in these scenes as well as make a point. I thought the cool part of this comic was the fact that I used movie scenes (without permission) that people would recognize and think was kind of cool too. If you notice at the end, Jesus isn't dead. His eyes are open! Basically saying The End? No, its not the end. It depends on the individual as to whether or not the religious side of Christmas is dead. I really thought everyone would see this, but instead you guys are too quick to criticize me. I am not trying to be a voice for religion or against religion. I'm simply pointing out what I see.

Oops
Posted by Ray

Ok, I am going to do something that is going to hurt me so, but here it is. I understand your point. I think I was hopping on the bandwagon trying to go against it. I interpreted it differently because that was how I saw it. I understand your point, I just think it could have been done differently, maybe actually having Jesus fight back for more than one panel. I was sitting there last night thinking about this and I realized I was making a mistake. I was coming across as one of the hardocre fundamentalist who are just as responsible for ruining this country as the socialist on the left, and I dont want to be one of those people. Hell, look at what I am fighting for with regards to the city police. I still think the one where He was carrying the cross is close to being touchy, but it still made me laugh the first time I saw it. So I'm dropping out of this moral crusade for now because it really doesnt bother me anymore. Religion is a touchy subject. Christian, I am generally a fan of your work. You have real talent (the Nightmare Before Christmas ending was well done btw). Sorry Blake, can't back you on this one.
good stuff
Posted by Michael Connner

I like it Christian! Good use of the commercial Christmas movies to prove your point.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

I don't know whether to applaud Ray for finally being rationale or to feel mortified that there is the idea of simply "jumping on the bandwagon" when it comes to interpreting something.

I guess I'll stand by the fact that this series (and its meaning) is too intelligent for many people. They see Christ and immediately say, "I'm offended."

There are schools out there for people like you.

ohhhhhhh myyyyyyyyy gooooooooood
Posted by gay balls

ohhhhhhhhhhhh myyyyyyyyyyyy goooooooooood. i loved it, but all those jesus fuckers are going to crucify you. love you hun...( thats christian's new nic name from me,,,, hun)
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Rick said: He even works back and forth mentioning Blake like they're best friends, yet never leaves an e-mail address.

Blake's Radford email was posted on one of the articles a couple of weeks ago.

And now this is funny. I'm a made up person now? Where did you get this info? News to me.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Rick said: He even works back and forth mentioning Blake like they're best friends, yet never leaves an e-mail address.

Blake's Radford email was posted on one of the articles a couple of weeks ago.

And now this is funny. I'm a made up person now? Where did you get this info? News to me.
Freedom to Live in Ignorance
Posted by Preston

This is completely wrong, but then again it is a choice of people in this nation to be completely wrong. If anybody, no matter what religion or worldview has ever read up on Christmas and its history which has always been about the Christian faith would understand how completely ignorant it would be to put something like this out. But then again, we do have the freedom to choose ignorance and stupidity and whoever lives in ignorance will die in uncertainty, typically depressed from alienating so many people. It's your choice.
Freedom to Live in Ignorance
Posted by Preston

This is completely wrong, but then again it is a choice of people in this nation to be completely wrong. If anybody, no matter what religion or worldview has ever read up on Christmas and its history which has always been about the Christian faith would understand how completely ignorant it would be to put something like this out. But then again, we do have the freedom to choose ignorance and stupidity and whoever lives in ignorance will die in uncertainty, typically depressed from alienating so many people. It's your choice.
I knew you weren't bright.
Posted by Rick Snee

Trust me, Ken--we all know Blake's e-mail address. You're the one without one. Once again, along with your grevious misinterpretation of this comic, you prove you have no reading comprehension skills.

Your name, along with "Nicolae" are both names from some Christian book series that happens to be Blake's favorites. You both coincidentally happen to be his biggest supporters in a debate where he doesn't have a lot of allies.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Preston's comments really surprise me from someone who lives in Jerry Falwell, USA and chooses to go to school there.

We all know that people at Liberty don't have the ability to be free thinkers. That is why they go to Liberty, to be told exactly what to think.

No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Rick: "Trust me, Ken--we all know Blake's e-mail address. You're the one without one. Once again, along with your grevious misinterpretation of this comic, you prove you have no reading comprehension skills.

I don't have an email? How'd you manage to figure that out? Psychic powers? Really, I'd like to know. Rick: "Your name, along with 'Nicolae' are both names from some Christian book series that happens to be Blake's favorites. You both coincidentally happen to be his biggest supporters in a debate where he doesn't have a lot of allies."

If I recall the blacks under the oppression of American slavery didn't have "a lot of allies". I suppose by that same notion you support slavery.

As for other posters I have no idea as to what people post what their name is. Heck, how do I know the person who posted as "Halley" is real? Her email listed isn't from a university - maybe she made it up.

However, I suppose that you're also interested in doing a hunt to figure out who gay balls and Negrodomus are as well since you seem to be working so hard to find my identity. If you need my help there just ask.
C'mon Ken, this is ridiculous.
Posted by Joseph Curulla

I'll quote you on this one Ken: "If I recall the blacks under the oppression of American slavery didn't have "a lot of allies". I suppose by that same notion you support slavery." What in the world are you talking about? Rick said that Blake isn't be supported by allies so that makes him support racism. I'm going to go out on a limb here and say that you meant that to be sarcastic. I could be wrong. For your sake as someone who wants to be seen as intelligent, I'm going to go with that thought and hope. If you're not being sarcastic, then you need to stop posting on here if you're going to accuse people of such false allegations.

You are being absolutely ridiculous Ken. Maybe you're a real person, maybe you're not, however these comments where you are slinging mud at others is exactly what gives people the wrong impression of Christians.

It's absurd to see all of these people complain about a toon. While you may not be happy with the toon, throwing out these stupid comments that Christian should be spelled Kristian and all the other hate-filled comments are getting ridiculous.

In case you were curious Ken, it wouldn't have been published unless it fit copyright laws. If you don't know the copyright laws then don't bring it up.


No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

I was being sarcastic man. Simply put, why does Blake and the others need a huge supply of supporters for it to be considered a legit faction? Even more, why does he have to have a huge supply for their side to be right? A good number of people here are simply appealing to numbers which is foolish. Does Blake need to have 10 people backing him to be considered a legit faction? 20 people? 30? A hundred? Thousand?
No Subject
Posted by K.R.

Anonymous: We all know that people at Liberty don't have the ability to be free thinkers. That is why they go to Liberty, to be told exactly what to think.

This is a joke right? They are taught the views of their professors, just like Radford students are taught the views of Radford professors. Granted Liberty is a bit more focused in their views but does that make them necessarily bad? No.
Still not bright.
Posted by Rick Snee

Never said Blake needed allies to be legit--for someone who wants to be the "watchdog third party" you still can't read--and getting very defensive now. And that's why I've been wondering who you are. That's an important (and unwanted) position for someone using a fake name, Batman. Negrodomus and gay ballz at least aren't arrogant enough to give themselves titles.

Since you brought it up, Negrodomus never posted on an article you commented on--just ones that Blake did. Do you read the comments for all articles, even ones in the past? Is that part of your online superhero beat? Are you "watching" our comments along with our articles to make sure they don't offend your timid sensitivities?

Sounds ridiculous, don't it? That's why I figure you've been here longer than your psuedonym, "Ken Ritz," has.
...
Posted by Michelle Pritchett

Well, since I'm graduating from Radford U in a few days, I can safely say that I wasn't taught the views of my professors, but rather I was taught how to come up with my own.

The point of education (and intelligence) is to interpret, analyze, and make your own rational conclusions, not to blindly follow the opinions of someone in a position of authority.

This comic is beautifully done, and I'm a bit saddened that people can't see its real meaning (which, may I point out, Christian blatantly stated) and feel the need for useless personal attacks.

Merry Christmas; Happy Holidays.

No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

"This is completely wrong, but then again it is a choice of people in this nation to be completely wrong. If anybody, no matter what religion or worldview has ever read up on Christmas and its history which has always been about the Christian faith would understand how completely ignorant it would be to put something like this out. But then again, we do have the freedom to choose ignorance and stupidity and whoever lives in ignorance will die in uncertainty, typically depressed from alienating so many people. It's your choice." You don't think it's ignorant to actually believe that the Christmas is still all about the Christian faith? I'm not saying by any means that there aren't Christians out there who focus on the religous aspect of Christmas, but to think that's the populations main focus sounds like choosing stupidity to me. I don't know about everyone else here, but I see far more ads for Santa, presents, reindeer, and stockings than I do about Jesus. To me, this says that commercialism has won over the religious aspect of this holiday. When I start getting more advertisements asking me to come celebrate the birth of Jesus than adds saying that I better come out and buy presents before a sale runs out, I'd be happy to say that this cartoon is a false statement. Until then, once again, well done Christian.
No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

I can say that the person who posted under "Halley" is quite real.

But what is your point, Ken Ritz? You picked someone who actually has provided an email in a way to counter the argument of the nature of your existence because you don't have an email? That doesn't seem to be a logical response.

No Subject
Posted by K.R.

I just want to know why I need to post my email to be taken as credible, Andrew Lent. Doesn't make alot of sense to me unless everyone wants to suddenly spam my email account.
Oh, boy.
Posted by Rick Snee

You want to be taken seriously as the moral compass for this publication, yet you don't even use your real name? That's why you're not credible. I know for a fact there's no "Ken Ritz" listed on directories at Radford, JMU, Virginia Tech, nor UVA. Nor is there one at any university in the nation participating on facebook.

You've got this huge important job to do with our literary magazine and you're afraid of spam? My e-mail is always up here and with my articles in The Tartan--that's not a legitimate fear.

If you'd like to "watch" over that student publication, too, it's www.thetartan.com. I wrote about Hooters and mentioned Jesus, too.
I'm back
Posted by Ray

but I see far more ads for Santa, presents, reindeer, and stockings than I do about Jesus Didn't Blake just write an article about that? You guys would have a fucking field day if religion was shown in public. So the question isnt whether or not Christ is losing to Santa, and I think all good Christians know he is not, but why you guys are allowing commercialism to take over the holidays because you might get "offended." Lets give everyone their fair say as long as they arent white Christian males.
No Subject
Posted by Ray/ATINAH

If Ken wants to post under a psuedoname, then who gives a fuck? I personally, out of response to a lot of articles, am going to start posting with the name ATINAH--A Towel Is Not A Hat. Why does it matter what their name is or where they go to school. Some people from other colleges post stuff on here because students from Radford show it to them. Are you trying to say that an internet magazine should only be limited to those who go to school here? If you are doing this for the general education of the public, then it doesnt matter who post. Remember when my mom posted? BTW, I've posted under SAWR sometimes only because I hate seeing my name every other post, but still think the message should be out there. I think I'm rambling, so I'll end it. Oh, and even though I dont post my email, people still seem to find a way to find me on myspace, facebook, and even a satellite image of my mom's house. Why do you guys care more who is saying what rather then what they are saying? This isnt anything new, you people (not all, some) have continuously attacked the poster rather than their arguments.
Okay
Posted by Rick Snee

Because he has deliberately stated he is the "watchdog third party" of this magazine. I have no problem with anonymous posters, but not if they give themselves a title that implies they are our moral guide on this magazine. If you notice, I have never called out someone anonymous before. This poster wants to be special and different, so I am treating him or her thus.
No Subject
Posted by K.R.

Would you rather I post as an Anonymous Reader? Dude, whatever title I choose to post under makes no difference, does it? Take what I say and judge that, not what my name is.

What's even more interesting is that you searched my name on Facebook for all those schools. How do you know I even have a Facebook page?
No Subject
Posted by Blake

"This isnt anything new, you people (not all, some) have continuously attacked the poster rather than their arguments."
Well put.
No Subject
Posted by Ritz Cracker

I would just like to state that Ken Ritz is in relation to me and my snack family. thank you.
No Subject
Posted by Ritz Cracker

Make that NO relation. It's hard to type when you are a cracker.
Thank you fellow jihadists
Posted by Ali babba shalabbah

I just wanted to say thank you for supporting the effort to destroy America, literally and figuratively.

Those clever and oh so secret messages that you implant in your cartoons are so cutting edge. Way to go Christian. Allah will bless you and let you rape women, kill children, and hang out with virgins in mock heaven. Keep it up!

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Well, we should at least be able to agree on one point: With each post Ray makes, he makes his idiocy more apparent. Hooray.
No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

I'm not sure where exactly Ali stands, but that made me laugh.
No Subject
Posted by Luke Rogers

Isn't vent the place for this type of debating? I liked the cartoon. Its funny to non-christians, and should be sad to christians not because it protrays jesus dying but the symbolism of commercialism overwhelming the true spirit of christmas is going on more and more every year. I think it makes a good point. It sucks it offended people, that never is a good thing. But just try and take it light-heartedly.
No Subject
Posted by K.R.

Kinda hard to take this one light-heartedly when a religious figure gets killed. Doesn't really matter who it is but in this case the One who got stabbed was Jesus Christ and no, there is no way to say He isn't dead here.
Watchdog
Posted by Ken Ritz

Rick: Because he has deliberately stated he is the "watchdog third party" of this magazine. I have no problem with anonymous posters, but not if they give themselves a title that implies they are our moral guide on this magazine. If you notice, I have never called out someone anonymous before. This poster wants to be special and different, so I am treating him or her thus.

I think Rick is just upset that people outside Radford University are witnessing this savage butchery of the freedom of the press.
No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

Good for Ritz. What are you so afraid of? that if everyone does this then you would have more opposition against it besides the three of us. I have only heard of one person who wants this taken down. I personally dont think it should, but if people want to read this and get offended, then they have the same right to lobby and speak against it as the people who want to see it up do.

As for the third party watch dog thing, I've told people to look at it and give me their opinion. If these people want to comment on it, why shouldnt they be allowed to?Some of these people go to Liberty, and I specifically asked them because they probably know more about Christianity than most people in here do.

SO I applaude people who get on here and get offended. It works both ways. No one is crying about you guys posting on Blake's and Brian's articles. Sure we think each other are wrong, but disagreement is what keeps each other in check.
No Subject
Posted by Blake

Agreed Ray. I'll come out and claim responsiblity for bringing in two people who posted on here. More attention the more people can see what is going on here and I think Ken stated it very well.

However I'm not paraoid about third parties here, like Rick is for whatever reason I do not know. In fact, I welcome third parties.
No Subject
Posted by Tricky Woo

Not only is this funny but it does have a point. Goddamn this is great. The quality looks a but rough. I guess you use jpegs right?
No Subject
Posted by Luke Rogers

Curious about what "knowing more about christianity" means. Is this in referenece to Biblical literature knowledge? Or is this about faith in christianity? Do people who know a lot about the Bible automatically good christians? I'm really don't know what was meant, and in no way am I trying to get into this argument, I would just like some friendly clarification.
Good God.
Posted by Rick Snee

When I comment on your articles, I don't need to call in the cavalry for support. I make a comment, I move on.

You guys feel you need outside help for what? To reiterate how offended you are? It's not like anybody's going to pull the comic, no matter how big of an angry mob you get out here.

In case you haven't noticed, this isn't the library steps.

And you're suggesting I'm the paranoid type? Pretty lame, guys. I reiterate, this is like asking my dad to post on here to make me feel valid.
CLASSIC!
Posted by daine

history in the making here, people!
No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

I meant that they have more knowledge about the what the Bible says and what more prominant leaders of the Christian community say. Because they go to Liberty it doesnt make them better Christians, it just seems that better Christians go to Liberty. Yea, I have my problems with that school and I'm definitely not saying everyone who attends there is more holy than thou, but at least the few people I talked to about this know more than I do.

I make a comment, I move on.
Than why are you still here?
It's not like anybody's going to pull the comic, no matter how big of an angry mob you get out here.
That almost sounds like a challenge to me. And you are wrong btw. If we really wanted it pulled, which for the record, I dont think forcing it off will help anything in the long run, but we could get it to happen.

No Subject
Posted by Blake

"It's not like anybody's going to pull the comic, no matter how big of an angry mob you get out here."
Don't be so sure.
bullshit
Posted by John

No one is going to pull his comic. I would like to see them try it!
No Subject
Posted by Blake

It will remain to be seen. Suppose that the next one or future issues are so vile (you love relativism people, so don't assualt me) that almost everyone opposes it. Perhaps people stage a protest (which I currently have no intention of doing at all so don't take that the wrong way) outside of Heth or the Whim office.

I know those are extreme examples but hey, enough people joined the "Radford's New President Sucks" group and got fed up enough that they made the news by protesting Kyle's party in the library.
Curious
Posted by Andrew Lent

It seems curious to me that we have a few people here, who say that they could get it pulled if they wanted to, but then rush in quickly to say that they don't want to do it.

What's the point?

Personally, I am growing weary of the subtle threats being made against this toon and this magazine and the childish antics that are being used against Christian. Argue the point here. It seems apparent that many readers just missed it altogether, or couldn't see it because they were wrapped up in their own interpretation, or refused to see it because . . . well, you have your reasons.


No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

This is why I personally dont want to see it shut down, and I and another person discussed this briefly. Yall already dont take us seriosuly half the time because of our political views. For better or for worse, arguments are taken from one article and used in another. This even happens from one week to the next. If we got it shut down and taken off, I think all of our future arguments would not be taken seriously because we would be seen as so close minded we wouldnt allow a simple cartoon to be put up. I'm saying you would be right in asserting that, merely it would happen. Secondly, I dont really mind this one. Yea, I saw it one way, but after Christian came out and explained his meaning by it I understand the other sides interpretation. And all of this threatening to take it down and we couldnt do it if we wanted is going to turn into a personal vendetta and only Christian will be screwed over because something he likes to do will be taken off because we had something to prove to each other. I dont see how getting it shut down is going to fix anything. Now if Christian were to be persuaded to keep from writing such contraversial cartoons, then taht is a different story. But it would have to be voluntary on his part
No Subject
Posted by Blake

"Argue the point here. It seems apparent that many readers just missed it altogether, or couldn't see it because they were wrapped up in their own interpretation, or refused to see it because . . . well, you have your reasons."
I think I know what you're trying to say and I can't see how anyone can justify what this comic clearly did.

And I'd be interested to see what you were wanting to say instead of the ". . .you have your reasons" part.

However I do have to agree with Ray - I'll be content with this series if Christian makes more like his first one than the "symbolism" ones he's done the vast majority of the time.
The real Woo
Posted by Woo

It's seems like somebody's resorting to high school behaviour to make a point. I'm going to ask again for whoever's posting under my name to stop. If you want to make me look like an asshole do it without posting under my name. I'm sure you can prove me wrong.
One last post on this comic.
Posted by Rick Snee

I'm still here because I smelled bullshit. You guys justed proved I was right.

Within a few comments, you first want to pull the comic, then you want it to remain: sounds like what you call "waffling."

Keep up the great work, Christian. Can't wait to see more of your work next semester.
No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

See, the point is, it doesn't matter if you are content. Christian is excercising his right to free speech with his satircal pieces. I understand his points, I think he makes his points very clearly and I appreciate the philosophical nature of many of his topics.

If, by some point, Christian draws an issue of the series that you are ok with, then that is for your own personal good, not a requirement of the cartoon. At the same time, if you take offense and have an issue with the cartoon, that is on you as well and is not a requirement of the author to either apologize to you or change the nature of his cartoon.

You can't please everybody, especially when it comes to religious topics (or political topics, or sports topics, or video game topics, or . . . well, any topic).

It is fine if you don't agree with the toon and would like the debate its merit, but the subtle threats of forcing its removal and the childish remarks toward Christian are just plain ridiculous and utterly despicable. The behavior of many people on this thread is appalling.

Theres a difference
Posted by ATINAH

Within a few comments, you first want to pull the comic, then you want it to remain: sounds like what you call "waffling."

This is how it is different than your buddyboy. At first, I read it and interpreted it one way. I still think people are allowed to see it in the negative light I first saw it in. Then, after Chrisitian told me his point, I understood where he was coming from. I still dont agree with it and think it should have been done differently. But I never called for it to be taken down. So in that regard you are wrong. Now if you want to talk about how I may have voted and gave support to go to war and then built my platform on an anti war agenda, or maybe if I posed with guns and in camo going hunting but supported a bill to severly restrict gun ownership, then I would be flip flopping.

Thank God we flushed the Johns in '04
Wise Words
Posted by Michael Conner

"I may disagree with what you have to say, but I shall defend, to the death, your right to say it." - Voltaire

While I do agree with the comic and find it quite amusing, I still think that quote holds water in this situation. Whether or not you agree with the comic and its meaning, having a healthy argument over it is perfectly fine. It keeps the democracy we live under in check. Plotting to take it down or making efforts to, however, is not. Just because you find it offensive does not mean everyone else out there does.

Ray,
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

"A towel is not a hat"???

I'd like to know where and how you came up with this assumption and why you think that people who "wear towels as hats", as you put it, are so bad...


No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

The expression came from a buddy of mine who learned it from a marine when he was on (military) cruise in Australia. I dont think I wrote it in this post, and i dont remember where I explained it, so I'll give you the basics.
It's not to be taken racially. It is more against the people who hate America and Jerusalem in the Middle East. Just because someone is Muslim or lives in the ME, that doesnt automatically make them a towelhead. When they hate America and everything we stand for, when they burn our flags, when they cheer when we are attacked, that gets them labeled a towelhead. Oh, and white people who live in the suburbs can be towelheads too, but I instead call them socialists, liberals, and other unsavory terms. If you sympathizse with the enemy and undermine America, then that gets you labeled as a towelhead. Be lucky I have only called them that. The other terms I know for them are disrespectful to cultures I dont have anything/much against.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Ray, c'mon, just stop. Go talk to some professors about it, maybe you'll listen to their logic, since you obviously have little of your own and you pay no mind to the sensible things occasionally spouted on on Whim.
No Subject
Posted by John

Some how this comment board was turned into Rays opinions page.
No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

Go talk to some professors about it, maybe you'll listen to their logic
Who should I go talk to? The socialist in the sociology department? Or how about the philosophy department? The English department is a little better because sans one teacher I had, didnt push their agenda on me. Anyways, would you liek to point out where I dont have any logic? This is just another example of someone attacking me instead of the issues.
Anyways, as for Some how this comment board was turned into Rays opinions page, isnt it great? I didnt want it to, but people cant seem to stay on topic. Sure I could be the bigger person and not respond to people when they directly ask me questions, but what is the fun in that? If yall dont want to hear me talk, dont ask my opinion. Oh, and I stopped posting here for a while but someones stupidity (Ashleigh/acadieux@radford.edu) made me step back in. So I will gracefully step down until someone either ask me something or says something so incredibly stupid itll warrant a response.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

unfortunately christian this is so true.....
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Ray, if you want to cite stupidity, just glance over your own posts and look at your own pseudonym and the logic behind it. You are a racist, ethnocentric homophobe.
No Subject
Posted by ATINAH

No, I'm just more right than you. I'm not racist. I dont like people who hate America. This is predominantly people from a certain area. I dont like French people, they're white. If anything, you can call me nationalist, but then I dont see anything wrong with that. Ethnocentric? No, I would like to see the world from your point of view, but (excuse the cliche) I cant fit my head that far up my ass. Homophobic? No, as long as they dont subject me to their lifestyle in public and definitely if they dont hit on me. So I prefer to look at myself not as though derogatory terms. Rather I see myself, as... hmmm... right?
No Subject
Posted by Ashleigh

This is just another example of someone attacking me instead of the issues.... Oh, and I stopped posting here for a while but someones stupidity (Ashleigh/acadieux@radford.edu) made me step back in. I'm glad you focus on the issues.
No Subject
Posted by me

somebody is going to hell whoever made up this comment cause that aint nice at all
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Alright, hey, if you want to go around calling people fags and towelheads and surround yourself with the mantra that you are "right" then go ahead. I think it is painfully obvious to many people in these forums that your level of intelligence doesn't amount to much. You got your fifteen minutes of fame with your little facebook group and now you think people actually give a damn about your opinion. Wake up, Ray and realize that you are a joke in the eyes of the Radford campus.

But hey, keep fighting for your right to drink yourself into an underage stuper. Oh and I love how you are so "right" yet TWICE you've changed your point of view on something you've crusaded against. Penelope Kyle would be one, you and that bone-headed petition. I guess you were wrong on your assumptions on that one. Then there is this comic. Everyone in the world is sitting here telling you what this comic is (and of course, you don't listen) and then Christian comes around and tells you and it suddenly becomes luminous to you.

Guess you were wrong there too.

But go on thinking you are "right". Your stupidity in every post is actually becoming entertaining.

You are a racist. A homophobe. An ethnocentrist. It doesn't really matter if you can see it, everyone else can.


No Subject
Posted by Blake

Darnit anyway, what is wrong with ethnocentrism if you find that it is true?
No Subject
Posted by Blake

Great. Stinkin Italics. I'll try to kill them.
No Subject
Posted by Blake

Test.
No Subject
Posted by Blake

There, excellent.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Find out what is true? Ethnocentrism speaks from a narrow point of view. But if you want to stay ignorant, that's on you.

It is amazing what you can learn when you educate yourself. I thought that is what we all were in college for. If not, maybe you should just drop out and assimilate yourself in SW VA culture.

No Subject
Posted by Blake

"I thought that is what we all were in college for."
I'm sorry but I didn't got to college to see whether the views I already had are legit or not.
Idiot
Posted by ATINAH

So now you are bashing SW VA culture? That doesnt sound very nice to me. How is you calling SW VA a bunch of stupid hicks any different from me saying the French for the most part shafted us because of their economic ties, or how the ME hates us? Hmm, thats a toughy. Maybe it is because when I say people suck, I actually have evidence to back up my position. And yes, thats what you are calling them so dont even try to deny it. So dont act all high and mighty and then in the very next sentence put down a culture. So you call me a bigot and I call you a hypocrite. But at the end of the day, I know I'm not a racist moron, and you are still a contradictory idiot.

And btw, ethnocentrism isnt a bad thing when what you are ethnocentric about is the best way. Unless you are saying America isnt the best, and then that just adds another reason to your growing list of reasons why you are an idiot. I hope to God people dont really think like you their whole life. Maybe that's why the democrat party is falling apart, because people are realizing how stupid this crap you are spouting off is.

No Subject
Posted by Luke Rogers

"And btw, ethnocentrism isnt a bad thing when what you are ethnocentric about is the best way. Unless you are saying America isnt the best, and then that just adds another reason to your growing list of reasons why you are an idiot." I don't think I'm an idiot, and I don't think the american way is the best...
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

What am I saying about SW VA culture? I'm saying that it is full of people with a disposition to be overly conservative to the point that their content with being "ethnocentrists."

I don't have any problem in saying that. I don't have any problem in saying that not everyone down here thinks like that either. But, no, I didn't call them a "bunch of stupid hicks."

I wouldn't say anything when you say there are people in the Middle East that hate us, or that there could, quite possibly, be a majority that hate us. But to call them your charming expression of "towelhead" and sign your posts with your "A Towel is Not a Hat" acronym and sit their snickering thinking you are clever is ridiculous.

You also know absolutely nothing about my political affiliation, so keep on assuming all you want. I'm sure there are plenty of conservatives out there who don't like racist, ignorant, culturally educated homophobes . . . or are you saying there aren't and that is an accurate representation of the Republican party?

And as far as the being ethnocentric when yours is the best. America is far from the best in everything we do. I love this country, it is a great country and I respect its values, but it would be rather arrogant (not to mention unfounded) to assume that we are the best, universally, across the board.

And I don't remember saying SW VA culture sucks, I said it was of a certain mindset, and if you don't want to broaden your mindset, then why go to college?

Blake, aren't you a political science major? If you didn't come to learn, why the fuck are you here?

No Subject
Posted by Blake

I currently am a Poly Sci major but I didn't select that as a major to be taught my views are wrong, which they are not.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Jesus Christ is risen today! Hallelujah!!
No Subject
Posted by James

After taking some time to read all of these posts I have some thoughts. Don't get pissed at me, just listen.

Conservatism is not equal, as you assert, to racism, homophobia, sexism, etc... It is no more synonomous than saying that all Liberals are valueless, spineless, pacifist, indecisive, dangerous, terrorists. Let that sit for a minute.

Next, if you all really want people to take your comments as legit. and if you really believe in what you write, you bold things you, sign your posts.

Coming to college in order to have your mind changed is hilarious. College is about critical thinking and learning to learn better, really. If for example, I were to bring my 18 year old ultra liberal daughter to RU what would you expect to happen. She should be rightfully taught that level headed thinkers blame WWII on liberal pacifists. 9/11 happened as a result of a do-nothing liberal. Conservative Republicans win elections because they are straight with people. They come right out and say what they think and let people know exactly what their deal is. Right now the DNC is changing their message, literally, every day. The DNC has not won 50% of the popular vote in a presidential election since 1980. There is a clue. Ever since then the party has gone further left, i.e. 2004, and further away from mainstream America.

I relize totally that someone will disagree, but go ahead. Number don't lie. In every poll taken and in every election done in the past 20 years, Americans, by vast majorities, identify themselves as Conservatives. We are talking about a MAJOR majority of Americans who love their apple pie and Christmas. ... Why do Liberals feel like these people need to be "enlightened?"

Point blank, Liberals need education. They need someone to let them keep their ideology, but also lay the facts in front of their face and force them to answer for the differences.

I hope all of this makes since. When you really get to, "enlightenment," then you learn to look at life. America is backlashing against the policies of the 60's and when life stares you in the face it is the Type A, hard working, absolutist, Christian, apple pie eating American that wins the intellectual argument, every time.

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Has anyone hear ever heard of Howard Zinn or Noam Chomsky?
SAWR
Posted by Ken

No and it's likely that people that value honesty and commom sense never will.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Well Ken, since you're apparently an expert on the both Zinn and Chomsky, why don't you go into some details?
No Subject
Posted by Drew

If you are offended by this, it's clearly over your head. Hell, Christians should even be INTO it. The only thing that this is espousing "hatred" or "bias" against is commercialism. Wake up assholes, and get a sense of humor. Life isn't black and white.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

James, I love you. You are my new role model. I wont even try to start to comment on what you said because you said it perfectly. Way to go, man!
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

The poster above is a different person than me.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

"Conservatism is not equal, as you assert, to racism, homophobia, sexism, etc... It is no more synonomous than saying that all Liberals are valueless, spineless, pacifist, indecisive, dangerous, terrorists. Let that sit for a minute."

I believe that was the point I was trying to make, or did we miss that?

"Coming to college in order to have your mind changed is hilarious. College is about critical thinking and learning to learn better, really."

I didn't say you needed to have your mind changed. I said you needed to broad your horizons. Part of critically thinking is being able to analyze and interpret material (something I see many people in here have problems with). If in the end, you come out conservative still, fine, there is nothing inherently wrong with conservatives. It is people with narrow, bigoted minds I have real issues with. In this thread, they just happen to be people who also affiliate themselves as being conservative.

As far as your statements about elections go, I'm not going to argue numbers. I don't consider myself a democrat, I have no ties to that party and they produce horrible candidates.

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

"I didn't say you needed to have your mind changed. I said you needed to broad your horizons. Part of critically thinking is being able to analyze and interpret material (something I see many people in here have problems with). If in the end, you come out conservative still, fine, there is nothing inherently wrong with conservatives. It is people with narrow, bigoted minds I have real issues with. In this thread, they just happen to be people who also affiliate themselves as being conservative."
And you assume that we haven't thought about how we think and as a result concluded that our views are right?
No Subject
Posted by Blake

Ok for some reason it didn't display my name. The above post was me.
No Subject
Posted by John

Wow, there is actually a facebook group against this comic. What a bunch of douchebags.
No Subject
Posted by Glenn Danzig

Yea they really take this shit too far... you'd think they would have more important wars to fight.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

An even better facebook group: They Don't Like Me On Whim Because I am Right
http://radford.facebook.com/group_profile.php?gid=6387
Created by yours truly. Blake's is still cool though.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

If only I had a Facebook I'd join.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

Yea they really take this shit too far... you'd think they would have more important wars to fight.

Sorry for getting pissed about killing my religious figure, making light of the burden of His cross, and the like. Where the hell do I get off defending my religion? Its almost as if I actually believe what they say in Church. Golly. (haha, I said golly) Anyways, as for the "more important wars," you mean like the one I am criticized for? The one where I am trying to stop the police corruption? Let's put it in ethnocentric terms for you. I'm like the US military--I kick so much ass, I can win at two wars at the same time.


So Ray . . .
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Posted by Ray

Ok, I am going to do something that is going to hurt me so, but here it is. I understand your point. I think I was hopping on the bandwagon trying to go against it. I interpreted it differently because that was how I saw it. I understand your point, I just think it could have been done differently, maybe actually having Jesus fight back for more than one panel. I was sitting there last night thinking about this and I realized I was making a mistake. I was coming across as one of the hardocre fundamentalist who are just as responsible for ruining this country as the socialist on the left, and I dont want to be one of those people.

Posted by Ray

Sorry for getting pissed about killing my religious figure, making light of the burden of His cross, and the like. Where the hell do I get off defending my religion? Its almost as if I actually believe what they say in Church.

So Ray, tell me which statement is true, because you change your goddamn mind every day depending on which way you think the wind is blowing.

I like it...
Posted by Amy

I'm going to have to say that if you dont see some sort of humor in this cartoon, you are taking it too seriously. This is brilliant and does exactly what it should do. It pushes boundaries. Its just what Id like to see more people do. Instead of hiding behind your religion, realize that others beliefs do not stop them from having a sense of humor. Kudos. I enjoyed this very much.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

I never said I liked it. I said I understood his point, but still didnt like it. I was backing off because I didnt want to be seen so hardcore against it, but I still am against it. Maybe it's just me, but I really dont see any contradiction there. And as for it pushing boundaries: if no one stood up against it, would it still be pushing boundaries? For every claiming this is so bold because it causes a stir, without us it would just be another ho-hum cartoon. (Dont get me wrong, the drawings are great, however the point wouldnt be so contraversial and would be no different than any other cartoon we see on whim.) And I'm not hiding behind my religion, I am using it to back my argument. And I never said dont have a sense of humor. Just have one in context. If I said I would shit myself laughing at the sight of a child being raped, in my mind I may have a sense of humor. Rational people would realize what is funny and whats not. Anyways, this cartoon wasnt made to be funny. It's supposed to get a message across. No where in there is any joke or anything humorous. For that alone people should say this is one of his worst cartoons drawn.
No Subject
Posted by stan

ok first, good job christian, this shit is hilarious, second, all of you bastards who are complaining about it, go fuck yourself, i'm pretty sure no one cares what you think, and the comics are more than likely going to keep being made, oh yea and if you're gonna keep "fighting for something" try something that actually exists, haha
No Subject
Posted by Cathe

This cartoon is extremely offensive. Jesus rose on the third day and He is coming back soon to take those who believe into heaven! Hallelujah!!
No Subject
Posted by Zoe

I can just imagine what these facebook groups are like...don't you people have anything better to do than complain about something that, if you actually THOUGHT about, is NOT meant to be offensive and instead can be seen as supporting Christ?

And I quote Christian (spelled with a C, like it or not), the writer of the toon, "Before I even drew this comic I knew I wanted to do one for Christmas that would depict the idea of the comercialized "santa claus" side of Christmas basically stabbing the religous "jesus" side of Christmas in the the back."

If you are still offended after Christian's explanation then that is your personal choice and I am sorry that you found it so offensive, but many of you haven't even THOUGHT about the toon, you merely reacted. Before you accuse someone, know exactly what you are accusing them of.

No Subject
Posted by Woo

That was honestly a very good post James. You made some good points but I'll put in my 2 cents anyway. You're right when you say we shouldn't come to school to have our minds changed. The political line of thought we most agree with comes from when we're younger than college age. I have not met too many people change their line of political thought between the ages 18 and 24.You're point about the DNC not receiving over 50 percent of the vote since 1980 is absolutely correct. Unfortunately I don't think it is a good indicator of political thought in the country. If you look at legislative elections since the 80's you'll see that democrats have received over 50 percent of the vote several times. Also the public opinion polls such as Gallup or CNN is a better indicator of the "national mood". This nation is more like a pendulum when you look at conservatives and liberals. We go back and forth all the time. I will agree that there is still quite a bit of backlash for the liberal 60's. As far as liberal's needing an education, I'll agree with that also. But I also think conservatives need it also. I think both lines of thought are pulling the nation apart. I'm a democrat and I get pissed at my party all the time for pandering to the far left. The republicans are guilty of this as well. Otherwise I think it was a great post.
No Subject
Posted by Zoe

I love how some of you keep using the term "liberal" as if it was a bad thing. Because of course being open to new ideas and being broad-minded (as being "liberal" is defined in the dictionary) is bad...

If you have political or social views that value change and progress, then it is simply ignorant to state that being liberal is a bad thing, because that goes against its definition and only shows that you do not have a correct concept of its meaning.

"Liberal" is actually somewhat of a positive term, according to the dictionary: Not limited to or by established, traditional, orthodox, or authoritarian attitudes, views, or dogmas; free from bigotry. Unless you happen to think that being a bigot is a good thing, which I do not. With all of this in mind, I am proud to be a liberal.

P.S: Since many of you obviously have a problem understanding anything that isn't spelled out to you (this toon, for example), i'll let you know that I was using some sarcasm in the first paragraph...

Disgusting
Posted by Lauren Ashworth

These comics are disgusting and very offensive. Save your filth for your own personal website not something that is produced by the University. I hope someone puts a stop to this.
No Subject
Posted by John

No one will stop this so save yourbullshit for the dumbass facebook group you dumbshit. Christian why don't you ever leave comments to back yourself up man.
No Subject
Posted by Christian

I've explained myself once already. Its not my fault people are dumb and can't read or figure out what the real point of this toon is. I'm done being pissed off over idiots.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Dude, this is pretty offensive. Way to ruin your humor with this shit.
No Subject
Posted by Ken Ritz

Christian: Its not my fault people are dumb and can't read or figure out what the real point of this toon is. I'm done being pissed off over idiots.

I'm not dumb. Perhaps you are for not seeing what your cartoon shows even if you didn't intend it to.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

To contribute to the Liberal-Conservative debate: Conservatives dont view change as always bad. However, they realize that not all change is good. Progressivism is not necessarily a good thing. Things have been a certain way for a number of years because they most often work and because people generally agree with their principles.

The way I took your post, Zoe, is by saying what Liberalism is not limited to and by not saying what Liberalism is, then you are implying Conservatives are all of those things. If you dont follow my logic, let me try to rephrase it. You are saying Liberals are not bad. They are the opposite of bad. Therefore, because the opposite of a Liberal is a Conservative, then the Conservative must be bad. Anyways, this is all a moot point because in the literal sense of the word, I doubt anyone in here is a classical conservative (the type with he little c). We are all liberals in the classical sense of the word, and I think that is where your definition comes from. Read that again because it is important! Someone in Europe would view all Americans as liberals, whether they are Conservative, Liberal, Socialist, or Progressive. Politcal affiliation in this country has nothing to do with the true definition of word.

No one in here wants the return of absolutist rule, so in that regard, you are right.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Has anyone ever thought that Christian, even though his intentions were one thing, created something he didnt intend to? Kinda like a Frankenstein's monster? He intended to create his idea that commercialism killed Santa, but in reality he stated much more than that. All of you people who are saying we are too dumb to see its true meaning: since when did art only have one meaning? Isnt reality a matter of individual perception? If we choose to interperate the cartoon one way, then doesnt its meaning become just that? If he is such a genius, then he would have made it so there is no room for interpretation and the point is clearly stated, not ambiguously done as seen here.
Revision to above post
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

***commercialism killed Jesus*** sorry, its been a long week
No Subject
Posted by Blake

"Has anyone ever thought that Christian, even though his intentions were one thing, created something he didnt intend to?"
That's been my position all along.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

Damn, didnt sign my name. That was me. Sorry.
random mess
Posted by Graves

News flash Ray... jesus is dead, so I doubt Christian's cartoon killed him. I think your just trying to gain attention by sounding like a complete tool/republican A-hole.

The biggest thing here is : Its Christian's Freedom of Expression and its not going anywhere. If it were to get kicked out because of a protest and Blake Foughts little holy war, then we would start our own protest to keep it on. It just goes around in a big circle, so why can't you just let it go.

If I wanna worship satan, Diss Jesus and ban Religion from my life its my desicion. No one will ever force me to believe their views. So don't try and save me from it, because whats offensive to you isn't offensive to me.

No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

I think what we all have to agree on is this:

People are going to bring their own interpretations to the cartoon. Christian said what he meant. There are people who appreciate what he meant, agree with what he said and liked it. Then there are people who didn't see what he meant, or they saw it but didn't like how he portrayed it.

That's the great thing about America, we can have our differences of opinion on it. All the childish "you're stupid", "no, you're stupid", "no liberals are stupid", "no conservatives are stupid" is just a load of BS.

Why don't we just end this cancerous discussion here, knowing that no one is going to change the others mind?

No one looks good in this mudslinging.

2 whole minutes
Posted by Dave

Haha I agree with Andrew, I just wanted to add that there is like 2,000 comments on this thing and it literally takes me 2 mins to scroll down.
No Subject
Posted by Bart

So Andrew Lent if he had the choice would rather yield to relativism and allow anyone to say anything than to question what's right and wrong? Wow things have gotten bad with Whim since I last checked them out a handful of years ago as a student.
No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

Bart, please elaborate your post, I'm not sure I fully understand where you are going.

People can question what's right and wrong, they can say whatever they want. I just offered a suggestion, since the discussion was degenerating into nonsense and nothing was being accomplished. I really can't see a "right" or a "wrong" in this comic. I see two different interpretations, that's all.

No Subject
Posted by David

How about everyone just listens to this song instead? http://www.menwomenandchildren.com/dance_in_my_blood.mp3
No Subject
Posted by Ray

It just goes around in a big circle, so why can't you just let it go. Like someone said, this post is way too long so I'll just reiterate even though this has been addressed. Its a way of checks and balances. If no one ever opposed it, there would be no limits. If no one ever questioned Hitler, he would be in power. The simple argument, "this is how things are so deal," doesnt fly with me.

That's the great thing about America, we can have our differences of opinion on it.Ironic how Lent advocates freedom of speech isnt it? Just as long as you don't have any medium to convey your message because if you do you are told you dont "reflect the views" of a certain online magazine.


No Subject
Posted by Ray

I see two different interpretations, that's all.So then how can you justify asking one person to leave the staff for voicing his interpretation. If you dont want people to get fired up like this, then how about you, as the "Overlord," take better editorial policies and not allow such sensitive subjects on the site?
No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

If you're going to take a behind-the-scenes shot at me, Ray, you mindswell make sure you get what I say correct.
Extreme, maybe?
Posted by Rick Snee

Why does everything here about a cartoon return to Hitler, slavery, the holocaust, crucifixions, and the complete and total collapse of America as we know it? Doesn't that seem a little extreme?

I blame the History Channel.
OK
Posted by Brian Erskine

I have some thoughts. Some of you who don't usually care much for me might like this.

1- The cartoon has a 'message.' The message is great, but the vehicle is the problem. The message of a living Christ and such does not make Christian some sort of saint who scores a pass from criticism. I am not saying he thinks that, but to put up a cartoon like this and not expect founded arguments is really really silly. Trust me on this, I have done it a few times myself.

2- James made some great points, but so did Andrew. A group of postings like this is a little ridiculous. The tag, you're it, is juvenille, like my spelling.

3- As far as this cartoon goes, it is a well-drawn cartoon. Its content is not some sort of saving grace intellectual stab at people like Blake and Ray. If sending the kind of messages Christian claims to send is really, really his purpose, then he is most obviously smart enough to understand his intention is failing. Take this trash into a church and tell them you are trying to glorify Christ, and see if you get hit in the head with a big black Bible :-)

4- The post made by Blake about Christian's intention v. the results is the crux of this argument.

5- I think he, being our friend, Kristian, as he is called, has a right to post this kind of cartoon on Whim. I think it is great for us to be able to see someone step in their own excrement.

6- Are these movie clips copyrighted, just asking?

Last one, let me pose a hypothetical. Please think about this one. A neutral figure named Joe Bob Brown puts up a cartoon depicting a black person being lynched as a joke, a Muslim being "tortured" in their underwear, a hispanic being shot while illegally crossing the border, a gay person being mocked about their deviant lifestyle choice etc...

Can you honestly tell me, with intellectual and character honesty that these posters on Christian's cartoon and the Whim staff would take kindly to such cartoons? You and I both know, on the level of friendship and honesty, that those cartoons would be on the front page of the Roanoke Times the next day.

Making fun of The Savior of the World is funny to some of you, and I'll spend the rest of my life defending your right to laugh. But, when someone posts one of the cartoons I talked about and mainstream America laughs at one of them, I don't want to hear you cry hate speech or anything of the sort.

That's a dose of honesty.

No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

thats a dose of shut the fuck up, there, erskine!
No Subject
Posted by Christi

Takes a big man to post anonymously and debate a good post with "stfu." Excellent rebuttals to the arguments continue to pour in.

Good job summing everything up Brian.


No Subject
Posted by Jump Salty

No one has said anything about posting something on Muslims, or black people or mexicans. If there was a point to it, then I would say sure it should go up. However, if it was in bad taste, Christian would probably step up and say this is pointless and disgusting. If he didn't, Andrew certainly would. This comic is not disgusting pointless. People keep saying, surely there was a better way to get the point across. Why? Then it wouldn't be as entertaining. This is the Toon section. I would like to see one of these whiny ass bitches draw something half as funny as the people who have submitted drawings. As for the low blows to Andrew, you criticize his decisions and yet...you aren't in his position. You take him for an idiot when in fact he looks at all aspects of things. He took the time to think about this series and talk with people to decide whether it should stay. Obviously its still here so obviously the powers that be say its ok. I think Whim has done an excellent job this semester and I hope to see more great articles and toons for the next.
No Subject
Posted by kristen

Well said, Salty! I couldn't agree more myself.
gross
Posted by whatev

ok..if youre just doing this to represent how christmas has become commercialized..then find some other way to do it. if you think that christianity is something to make light of..then whatever. i personally am getting tired of everyone in this freaking nation taking away christian rights..people cant even say merry christmas anymore..nothing against other religions or whatever, but christmas was our holiday first, and ill say merry christmas if i freaking feel like it..
No Subject
Posted by James

Did Brian attack Andrew? I can't find it.
Please say something original.
Posted by Rick Snee

"This is offensive!"
"No, it's art!"
"What if someone made a comic with lynched black Muslim babies raped in Holocaust concentration camps?"
"Hello, it's about commercialism and you're too dumb to see it!"
"That's my savior, jerkface!"
"Stupid conservative!"
"Stupid liberal!"

Okay, it's all been said. Do we really have to reiterate the same crap over and over again? Please say something original, no matter what you think.
No Subject
Posted by Hannah

I would have to agree that this cartoon is offensive. I have no problem with the message of the cartoon, if it is that the true meaning of Christmas has been lost. But the mode of that message is out of line. Regardless of what the cartoonist is trying to say, it is absurdly innappropriate to portray Jesus being murdered by Santa Clause. Christ died and rose once, and that being the hope that we have, it is nothing to joke about. If you are not a Christian, and do not believe any of this, please at least have enough respect for others not to mock Jesus, or to use Him in a belittling manner to put forward an opinion.
Jesus is Alive!! Hallelujah!
Posted by Cathe

"News flash Ray... jesus is dead" Jesus is NOT dead, He rose on the third day! "Him God raised up on the third day, and showed Him openly, not to all the people, but to witnesses chosen before by God, even to us who ate and drank with Him after He arose from the dead." Acts 10:40-41
No Subject
Posted by Ray

Hust noticing something... how much did everyone miss the mark saying no one cars about Jesus anymore on Christmas? Are you going by the liberal and secular media? Because if you were going from your personal experience, i.e. this forum, I would say the true spirit of Christmas is alive and kicking, just being challenged by some people who don't understand or know what they are talking about.
Enough
Posted by Dave D. ( not other Davids)

It is late in the posts, but I have one thing to say. Enough with these messages of fighting because Christmas is coming near. I find this comic in poor taste, but fighting solves nothing. I am ashamed of the language, and hate that are on these boards. I hope that all of you are forgiven, and I wonder why so many posts exist in the first place. As a Christian I love God and Jesus more than anything. And with that love I know that Jesus is much stronger than I ever will be, and the Bible shows me that Jesus can defend himself. I see no more need for quarreling between anyone. I wish you all a Merry Christmas and hope you remember what it really is about. Thanks for your time.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Haha santa killed jesus with a butter knife i love it.
No Subject
Posted by Chelsie

Wow! I miss all these old Christmas movies... I need to watch some before Christmas time comes along.
No Subject
Posted by Graves

haha i love how this thing reminds me of that family guy episode where peter fights the chicken... hahahaha god it cracks me up..... oh

and by the way last night on family guy peter said that christmas time was a time when "the ghost of jesus christ rises from his grave to feed on the flesh of the living" then some guy goes "BLASPHAMY I SHOULD DO SOMTHING" another one looks at him and says... "theres nothing you can do." so the guy responds with "well i guess ill just have to develope a sense of humor then."

.... i think that pretty much sums up all these debates thank you!

No Subject
Posted by Bart

Well Mr. Lent, it's just for an old alum like me who had checked in to see what is going on with you folks today at Radford, I feel that it is quite concerning that you see two interpretations as you say and yet action on those you are not taking. Both sides are clearly on the opposite ends of the spectrum if you will and it appears that you seem to have a growing problem on your hands. I see what both sides are saying however one could not stand by, as the example that some of the folks here have so commonly used and say that the Nazis of whom who my uncle died fighting against in the War and the Jews were not right or wrong and there were two differing sides. In something like this one side has to be right and the other wrong. They cannot both be right likewise they cannot both be wrong. What is your view Mr. Lent?
No Subject
Posted by Take a guess

Woo fuckin hoo for classes being cancelled. Drunk at 5! I know thats not very Christian like, but whoever said we should just get along, I think it was David Duckett, good for them. Rodney King said it best after he was fucked up for speeding through a neighborhood fucked up on drugs: Cant we all just get along? Yea bitches. Sorry for the drunk post
No Subject
Posted by Bart

Well that is one thing that has not changed much since my days at Radford. You folks are keeping it up!
No Subject
Posted by Andrew Lent

Bart, I would allow people the freedom to interpret the cartoon. If you wanted to know what I saw, I saw the symbolism between a battle between the meaning of Christmas and the commercial aspets of Christmas.

I cannot force others who do not see this, or who are offended, to see it the way I see it.

No Subject
Posted by Ray

Sorry for the above post. I've slept it off and am a little better now. I'll be back to my normal self later. I'm going back to bed. All I have to say is you have to anticipate how people are going to react. Claiming ignorance because you didnt know how people would interpret this cartoon is no excuse. Bottom line is this isnt the first time people have been offended by Christian's toon and it probably wont be the last. So saying that because people dont see it the same way as you doesnt cut it
No Subject
Posted by Josh

"I am totally serious, let's try this. I should draw a cartoon with a soldier stabbing some damn towel head and then have one of Bush drowning the black people in Katrina. Is that funny? Neither is this." I'd pay money to see that.
No Subject
Posted by Bart

Mr. Lent I would like to ask if you think the means shown in the art is quite possibly a foot too far in terms of method. This has no real meaning to me but I think that this art work could be done in a much more pacifist method as the blood and violence in this art is in poor taste.
Mr. Bart.
Posted by Rick Snee

Hey, Bart. Mr. Lent didn't draw it; Mr. Keesee did. If you disagree with his methods, go to the source.

Kudos for graduating.
No Subject
Posted by John

Bart, Fuck you. Just shut up. You'll make no difference in this matter so shut the hell up!
No Subject
Posted by Jason

Say bye bye to that gayass facebook group. 40 members, a buncha groupies, and you still made no difference. Wow, nice job douchebags.
No Subject
Posted by Bart

Well if nobody desires me here I shall depart. Good luck with your endeavours future graduates.
No Subject
Posted by Adam Frazier

I think if you just look at the very last panel of the comic, you'll get the point.

Jesus is betrayed (stabbed in the back) by his own people, turning a holiday that was originally about his birth, into a commercial season of sales and purchasing.

Why do people have to get so worked up about this? If you don't like it, that's fine - if you like it that's fine. If you want to share an opinion, that's fine too - just realize that it's not going to change anything. No one's going to crawl to your feet and proclaim you as the all-knowing just because you feel so strongly about a COMIC STRIP.

No Subject
Posted by Ray

Jesus is betrayed (stabbed in the back) by his own people
No, He is being betrayed by the people who put this shit up. His own people are Erskine, Fought, Ritz, myself, and others who have taken a stand against this. We are the ones who realize what the meaning of Christmas is about, and cartoons/post like these from the people who have been lost are what is making people like you think the meaning of Christmas is gone.
No Subject
Posted by Blake

"Jesus is betrayed (stabbed in the back) by his own people, turning a holiday that was originally about his birth, into a commercial season of sales and purchasing."
I'd disagree - I haven't forgotten the reason for the season and it's not a fat guy in a red suit, it's the birth of the Savior of the World.

However I do want to come out here and apologize for my earlier actions of attempting to get this series removed. It's kinda foolish to claim that I can be able to speak in opposition to it if I won't allow the other side to put up what they think.

That is all.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Once again, you two are unable to understand what was said. Not surprising. Adam, you nailed it.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

I understand completely what Christian was (supposedly) trying to say. I understand what Adam is saying. I disagree though. I am just saying that they are both wrong, and by continuing to believe this is happening, you are in essence creating a self fulfilling prophesy:
You say Christmas is dead at the hands of commercialism-> draw cartoons to show this-> people follow these cartoons and believe it to be true-> become disollusioned with the season-> ultimately stop celebrating or celebrate for the wrong reasons-> Christmas truly becomes dead.
Using this logic, Christian and his followers have killed Christmas just as much as the "corporations" have.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

Let's see if people get offended by this(NSFW): http://media.ebaumsworld.com/wmv/cbkwanzaa.wmv
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

That's pretty far off the mark, Ray. This comic is as much responsible for taking the "Christ" out of Christmas, is that what you're saying? I mean, you've made plenty of idiotic statements before, but this may take the cake for the dumbest. Do you seriously believe that, or is that all you could come up with?
No Subject
Posted by Ray

How far off the mark is it really? It makes perfect sense to me. The reason why there is a competition between the true meaning of the holiday and hte commercial aspect of it is because people allow the commercial side to dominate. If people focused on the true meaning instead of focusing on how it is losing to commercialism, then maybe this wouldnt be an issue after all. Check out the two newspaper articles in NC States student newspaper. If people stopped writing about how there is this big debate and starting a fight and instead spoke of the true meaning of Christmas, could openly talk about the blessings of Jesus, then we wouldnt have to be at each others throats. I'm not saying sweep it under the rug, but you are only adding fuel to the fire, and you are aiding the wrong side.
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

This comic strip doesn't support commercialism over any meaning you associate with Christmas, it merely points it out...in hilarious fashion.
Just Stop Ray, We Heard You Already
Posted by The All Singing All Dancing Scum Of The Earth

Ok, honestly, I've been reading all of these and why is Ray still posting. Yes, we get your point. I think you enjoy the attetion or something. Its becoming very redundant. You Brian and Blake are all bible hugging, church going saints. And I don't think Brian or Blake asked you to bring them into this. They can speak for themselves and they have. So Ray, please stop posting cause you only make yourself sound like a jackass and basically repeat what you've been saying over and over. This is not a bad comic, or a bad message as much as you want it to be. People like you is what scares people away from religion. Not this comic.
Jesus.
Posted by Rick Snee

Yes, Ray, we get it. You're offended. Post something new if you need more attention.
To those who oppose: Why such a show?
Posted by Aslan

Jesus, who said that we should come to God with the humility and innocence of a little child, warned against ostentatiously displaying our piety in public to be seen and admired by others: "And when you pray, you must not be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and at the street corners, that they may be seen by men. Truly, I say to you, they have received their reward. But when you pray, go into your room and shut the door and pray to your Father who is in secret; and your Father who sees in secret will reward you. And in praying do not heap up empty phrases as the Gentiles do; for they think that they will be heard for their many words. Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him." (Matthew 6:5-8)
No Subject
Posted by celine

SOOOOOOOOOOOO HILARIOUS
No Subject
Posted by Michelle

I love how a kid who bitched about getting in trouble for drinking underage is getting all "holier than thou" about a comic. Ray, get off the soap box and find a worthwhile cause.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

Since you brought it up: first off, I have never been arrested for anything, much less alcohol. Secondly, I am turning 21 soon so it really isnt going to effect me much longer, but I still make it an issue because it's not right to the younger students. You dont find it troubling that "Radford police wrote more tickets in 2 months than the entire blacksburg police wrote last year?" (http://www.roanoke.com//news/nrv/wb/41506 ) That doesnt seem like something to raise an eyeborw at?

So if keeping a city of corrupt police under control isnt a worthy enough issue, and defending my religion isnt either, then what in your eyes should I be worried about? What type of starch to use to get the most pop out of a collar, perhaps? Maybe instead of me finding something else, you should stop being so apathetic to what is going on around you. Would you rather me sit back and watch my friends get arrested, hear stories about kids being arrested for drunk in public inside a bar, hear of police using entrapment? What happens when it is you who get in trouble? THen you are going to wish someone stood up for you. So I'm going to keep fighting these inbred, cant find a job in a real town, police because I've had enough of them. And not just I've had enough, every student who has a social life has had enough of them.

No Subject
Posted by Adam

"inbred, cant find a job in a real town, police" - Ray

Mmm, but aren't Christians supposed to love each other? I mean, shouldn't you remove the plank from your own eye before scrutinizing the splinter in another's?

No Subject
Posted by Ray

Mmm, but aren't Christians supposed to love each other?
Never heard that one before. I think you are being too specific here. I wouldn't wish harm upon them. No one says I have to like them. Should I love child molestors and rapist? No. I'm tired of that being used as a rebuttal. Yes, you are supposed to love everyone in a global sense as we are all God's children. However, that doesnt mean when someone does wrong they souldn't be called out on it. Plus, did I ever say I am a good Christian? I never said I was perfect or anywhere close to it. If you guys want me to stop posting, stop being stupid.
Obviously talking about the police isnt on topic for this forum, but seriously, there are bigger problems at hand herre and you guys choose to nit-pick on my name calling. Stop avoiding the real issues.
I'll say it again
Posted by I've said it before

Ray, just shut the hell up. You are a hypocrite and you are only making yourself look like a dumbass. So just save it cause no one values or respects what you have to say anymore.
Awesome
Posted by RobX

I love how you placed the characters into all those famous movies. I thought it was funny. It's a joke, all the religious whackos should lighten up.
Not caring for your cause isn't apathy.
Posted by Michelle

A: I never said you got arrested, Ray;
B: It's not a worthy cause to champion underage drinking rights. You can have a social life and not act a damn fool after a few cups of Natty--but that seems to be a problem for most kids;
and C: Will you still care when you're of age?

I don't call it apathy to not be bothered by cops doing their jobs. When I see some obviously underage punk kids kicking over mailboxes and screaming in the streets, it's not going to keep me awake at night to know they got a ticket.
Merry Christmas
Posted by Ashleigh

Merry Christmas! (regardless of what you think of this cartoon)
No Subject
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Fuck christmas, bunch of greedy materialistic-ass contradicting asshole christians. HAHAHA
Lame and sad
Posted by SHON

God still loves you. Don't worry about offending me, I feel sorry for you and hope you repent before it's too late
Repent?
Posted by Some Anonymous Whim Reader

Repent? What for? I don't see what anyone on here has done wrong other than verbally bashing other people.
No Subject
Posted by Ray

So how many times did people see Ralphie kick the crap out of that bully during the 24 hour marathon of A Christmas Story? I think I saw it at least 3 times, probably 4.
Inside Whim